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new to sub

Discussion in 'Detoxing From Buprenorphine/Subutex/Suboxone' started by RS8877, Jan 12, 2015.

  1. StuckonSubs

    StuckonSubs Well-Known Member

    How is the taper going? Have you started it yet? Are you still on the subs? Or are you back to the oxy's? Hope all is well!
     
  2. RS8877

    RS8877 Member

    i'm still on subs.. i stopped all together for a few days -- then had upset stomach one morning and wasn't sure if it was the sub or not, so i took some more.. done with oxy's now though.. think the subs are just mental.. i go to the dr wednesday and he'll give me 30 more.. and i'll refill but won't use them all.. in last month i used maybe 15 of the 30 i get.. Dr wants me taking 1 a day until then end of april, then taper for 3-4 months -- ha ! f that.. i thin he just wants the $$

    after this next visit i'm going to stop or wein down if necessary and I will update everyone

    thank you for following up.. it means a lot esp since you don't know me.. but you care

    so thank you! much appreciated!

    ps- once i stop taking the subs.. how long b4 completely out of my body? bc then i'll know if any w/d or not right? i don;'t think i'll have sub w/d, but ou never know!
     
  3. getoffsubs

    getoffsubs Well-Known Member

    Hey RS - what dose of sub on are you taking, how many mgs per day? Once you stop, it could take up to 3 days to completely leave your body.

    Just fair warning, you aren't getting out of this without some sort of WDs but I have no doubt you can do it. I tapered down to about a 1/4mg per day and I feel I got off pretty easy, but nothing is easy when it comes to addiction. Others have stopped at 2mgs and others much higher and made it. You can read my story and others below but keep in mind, everyone's experience is going to be slightly different.

    Upset stomach is one of the main symptoms for me and my stomach still hasn't fully recovered and I'm past 100 days. Taking a fiber supplement has helped along with good eating but I was taking immodium on and off for at least the first 45 days. All I can say is you have to embrace the withdrawal symptoms but don't focus on them. If you had an upset stomach under an other circumstances you wouldn't think twice about it. Our damn brains tell us "OH NO, upset stomach, must take more sub"!

    Good luck and hang in there! We are here for you!
     
  4. ibogainelife

    ibogainelife Member

    Please do yourself a favor and stop the suboxone before it's too late. Try to cut in half everyday for a few days and then stop. It literally would be better to switch back to a short acting opiate if you stay on subs any longer. If you can afford it, consider switching back to a SOA and get ibogaine treatment and eliminate all withdrawals. If you stay on suboxone any longer you are looking at worse withdrawals and longer-term than any other opiate. Take it from me and my personal experience, I couldn't come off of a half mg of suboxone so I switched to a short acting opiate and did ibogaine treatment and it was the best experience of my life. Watch out for shady and money hungry providers. Message me for tips, advice and/or recommendations. Freeibogaineadvice @ g mail. com
    best,
    B
     
  5. RS8877

    RS8877 Member

    ok just went to DR yesterday -- my first post in a long time I feel

    Dr is suggesting I drop it down 1/8th every couple days... so i'm still on 8mg film -- hes saying by next month i should be at 7/8th a day or maybe even 6/8th a day.. Honestly i think i can drop it faster...

    I have gone a day or 2 without taking it..

    Question.. how fast should I taper?

    Sides: no i did get the sweats the other day... IT could be #1. bc its summer and hot #2. bc my twins make me sweat bc their nuts and #3 bc sub not in my system
    so tobe safe I was taking the sub

    Question:
    what are sides of stopping cold turkey? or just the sides overall?
    bc i recall i used to go through w/d from Percocet originally back in the day .. sweats.. nom energy etc... but i didn't even realize then it was w/d bc i was so new to all of this

    so just asking experiences users.. what are the sides I can expect -- so if a taper to quick I'll know the exact reason

    again this board has been extremely helpful and thank you all for helping!
     
  6. spring

    spring Administrator

    Just in case you are considering Ibogaine...which personally I dont think is necessary considering the expense of it and the fact that you are down to such a low dose...but if you are please contact Bonita about it. She is a long time member and we know her personally. This guy in the previous post may be very legit, but we dont know him from Adam.

    Someone will come along with some advice and experience for you but in meantime post #23 had some some good things to say about it.
     
  7. StuckonSubs

    StuckonSubs Well-Known Member

    I would taper as fast as you can handle! Why not? The faster you get to 2mg or less, the better in my opinion.
    As far as symptoms, everyone is different when it comes to sub it seems like. My general taper w/d symptoms were a little bit of restlessness and uneasy feeling, feeling of anxiety/worry, mild aches in my legs and back (it would come and go, it usually wasn't a constant thing), a little trouble sleeping, low energy. Stuff like that. But really, compared to other types of opiates that ain't bad at all.
    What I found about sub w/d is that it was more/less a milder version of opiate w/d that lasted a little longer. I mean, it definitely still sucked but it was totally do-able.
    I went off at around 1mg though. The lower you get the better. People who have those nightmare stories are the ones who went cold turkey off high doses.

    How fast do you want to be off? I would taper faster than what your dr is recommending if I were you. No reason to go that slow. At least not yet. Save that for once you get under 2mg if you want to taper all the way down to nothing.
     
  8. RS8877

    RS8877 Member

    yea dr recommend i taper from 8mg to 7 or 6 mg by end of month 1... so thats next week... honestly if I take 4mg or 6 mg its all the same to me
    Starting next week i'm going to keep legit track and just take half of the 8mg strip.. so 4 mg a day for a week.. then 3 mg following week and see how i feel at the dnd of next month where I should be down to 1-2mg.. and I guess go from there

    only good thing about subs is that no cravings for percs or oxy, etc.. I will again update in a week or 2.. this board has been great...
    and I'm going to go back and rer-read post #23 if I can find it:)
     
  9. RS8877

    RS8877 Member

    i'm making a point to get down as much as I can by end of July.. so right now anywhere between 4-6mg a day.. goal is 2-3 mg
    I have heard under 2mg -- to 0 is tough part
     
  10. Fox face

    Fox face Moderator

    I was on Subs for 7 months, started at 24mg a day, 3-8mg pills a day taken as one dose first thing in the morning. 2 months 24 mg, then 3rd month dropped to 16mg- I didn't notice the drop. I dropped to 8mg, the 4th and 5th month, still didn't notice the 8mg drop. My 6 month I dropped from 8mg to 2mg. Your right, that's when it gets tuff, so I jumped. I did start feeling the withdrawal, but when I ask my pharmacist about it and was told that I would withdraw from it no matter what dose I got down to.... UGh! I thought that was the whole point of the subs. I started dropping on my own and when I didn't go back to my doctor at 5 months, they called to see how I was doing and to see if I was still in the program. I told them I was great and had enough subs for another month, I was told in order to stay in the program, I had to come in monthly. They were missing my $100.00 cash. I never went back! I found this site and got off the stuff. I was sick as he11 for about 3 weeks, but if others could make it through, I knew I could too! I'm glad I was on it because it gave me 7months of not wanting, chasing,needing drugs to function ... I didn't crave anything while on subs or coming off of them. For that I am grateful!

    This November will be 2 years off Subs. It has been a hard road, but well worth the ride, to have the freedom, I do today! The girl I thought was lost, has been found!
     
  11. spring

    spring Administrator

    Hey FF,
    I never get tired of reading posts like yours!! It gives people hope that it can be done. I havta say I agree that no matter how low on dosage you go, there's going to be some pain involved when it's eventually stopped, so why prolong it?

    RS, You're doing great so far, but please try not to get stuck at 2mg when you get down to it. Many are afraid of the final jump, but the fear of it is most always worse than the actual detox symptoms. This will be the time to read posts such as FF above and many others for encouragement. I'm glad you're keeping a journal of your journey. Someday you will be able to look back on it and see how far you've come...not to mention that others who are in the spot where you are now will benefit from your experience.
     
    RS8877 likes this.
  12. StuckonSubs

    StuckonSubs Well-Known Member

    How are you doing with the taper?
     
    RS8877 likes this.
  13. RS8877

    RS8877 Member

    ok first, let me thank you for tyour comments -- I don't check as often as I should -- and reading the comments above are excellent motivation
    i'm starting to tamper with my Dr -- and reading through this board and others
    So i'm taking 1/2 to maybe 1/4 of the 8mg film per day... I say I need to cut it up and keep track,,,, but i usually just tear a piece off in the AM --- i know thats the wrong way

    So what i need to do is get down to my 2mg -- However couple questions:
    1. WHY? why should i rush to get OFF Subs when they have been great to me... it blocks my ability to get high if I took a perk or 2 (yes i tried that months agos and felt nothing) BUT since then I really don't have the cravings.. so Although i want to staop bc I do believe everyone on this boards whom helps me... I am scared of the sides... like Noooo way I can have 3 weeks of sides (as I'm self employed) and have 22month old twins!!! So i need to be active.
    I don't feel the sub hinders my performance at all really.. it just does what its supposed to do.. curbe the cravings!!

    2. Alcohol - I notice i really have NOOO desire to drink anymore either --- is this just a stage in my life or anyone else experience this?

    3. the Withdrawals -- thing I'm literally scared of... i need to mentally prepare myself and know what I'm about to get it IF i do this sooner vs later. I'm a tough guy at 63 and 230lbs -- but mental toughness with WD is the hardest thing i had to go through (Shit tearing my Ball n Socket) in my shoulder and having surgery was easier recovery that WD from opiates!!!!
    So do I get down to a Sliver -- lets say 2mg a day (as FYI max i ever took was 8mg film - never more & i'm doing all of this for my own good where I walked into a Dr with a problem and tell spilled the beans) -- so back to 2mg a day -- when you say JUMP -- do mean mean Stop cold turkey? what about trickling fdown to the 2mg mark... then take as needed? maybe 2mg in am and if feel need to -- 2 mg afternoon... then maybe a few days later I'll only need to the 2mg in the am -- Then the 2mg EOD -- then maybe Every 3rd day -- etc --- would this be a wise choice?

    4. Does everyone have WD from subs.. i feel if i missed a dose one day I would be fine.. as I recall in the past I have -- but i know it last in my system longer now too...... sO will i def have side effects? and shoot me straight -- when will I feel or expect -- Day by day! Bc WD in past was HORRIBLE for me
    my past WD - was Cold Sweats/ runny nose/ bad sleep/ ZERO energy - lay in bed all day like it was my job! / no appetite either ---
    I just don't want to go down that drastic road anytime soon..... so I'd prefer taking 2mg Subs than WD --- but if I can taper down properly -- can I then have Zero WD?

    Again - everyone who has replied - I appreciate your help, your honesty, your stories/ experiences... It's def reassuring coming onto this board and speaking Openly about it -- I tell my Dr and my Wife.. but unless thier in my shoes... they don't understand it.... So thanks for everyone s help and support and feel free to chime in with you own answers to my questions -- I realize everyone is different so theres no 1 correct answer -- but to hear several experiences with the same outcome -- Clean -- would be nice to read!

    xo
     
  14. RS8877

    RS8877 Member

    so I have no exact dose i'm down to today to clarify.. I'll safely say 4mg or less --- starting today i'm going to do 4mg / 3mg/ 2mg -- and see how I do at the 2mg mark -- then once i read some replies from my above email i'll then decide on what to do as far as completely coming OFF
    thanks
     
  15. freakedout

    freakedout Moderator

    Hey RS,

    1st....FEAR of withdrawals is what kept me on maintenance opiates over 9 years. (7.5 on Methadone, 1.5+ on Sub.) Looking back, this was all in my head. I also thought that the Methadone/Sub was a godsend at first and these methods of "treatment" were highly recommended by the "professionals" who make money off my being on them. My thinking on this sure has changed. The mental change didn't happen immediately but 9+ years opiate free and I do have some perspective now.

    #1 - You should not rush off of Subs since you have been on them for awhile. Please understand that the Sub you take daily is not the amount of Sub that is active in your system. It has a ~37.5 hour half life. So if you take 4mg one day, and 4mg the next day you will actually have ~6mg active in your system. Take 4 the next day and now it is around 7. Not exact math but the point is you have WAY more Sub in your system than you may realize. The only way that I know of to "unwind" this stacked up half life if a slow and gradual taper. Being in a rush never works out.

    #2 - No idea...have heard that some people are medicated with Sub to keep them from using Alcohol. I drink occasionally now and when I was on Sub. Nothing in this respect has changed but I have never been a heavy/problem drinker.

    #3 - This one is all over the place. I can only speak from my experience. I did not experience any noticeable acute withdrawals after I stopped Sub. I strongly believe this was because I did a long term taper using the liquid dilution technique and precisely controlled the downward doses until I ended at .025mg a day. I went to every other day dosing, every third day, eventually forgot to take any and a week or so later realized it had been over a week since my last dose and I didn't feel any negatives. About 6 months or so later I generally felt better all around but there was absolutely nothing dramatic. (I felt kind of dumb being scared of something that never actually happened!)

    #4 - Who knows. I didn't experience any but many people do. Just my opinion but I think a slow, controlled taper is the key for people who have been on Sub for awhile.

    I would suggest googling "suboxone liquid dilution taper" to find some more info. 2mg is actually a very high dose to jump off from. (Have to say it, but the marketer/mfr of Sub designed the dose levels available to NOT be taper friendly to keep the revenue stream going.) If YOU want to stop, it is definitely realistic with a good plan and follow through. For me not being dependent on ANYTHING is absolutely priceless. PRICELESS. I didn't need any more reason than that ;)
     
    RS8877 likes this.
  16. RS8877

    RS8877 Member

    thanks i'll look up that method
     
  17. RS8877

    RS8877 Member

    just logged back in -- strting today I'm going to taper down -- well i was tapering down over the last 2 months but literally tearnong off a piece of the 8mg film --- i know i know

    Freakedout - thank you! your right -- what am I scared of -- I have no issues jumping out a plan to sky dive -- why should i be scared of this --- Game on!

    Honest question -- say if i just STOP -- what will happen?
    Also - what are the w/d symptoms? bc i recall when i have perks years ago and ran out -- i felt like sit - but nevcer put 2 and 2 together -- i just want to know if I'm dropping down the dose to fast

    i'm at 2mg still today -- and I been hanfging there -- bc like I said - why not - its working for me BUT like most i don't want to be dependant on the Damn dr taking my $150 every month --

    Game on Dec 22nd - it starts!

    thanks EVERYONE -- i will post again from time to time!

    Happy Holidays!
     
  18. Fox face

    Fox face Moderator

    Happy Holidays RS, Game On, I like it! We are waiting on the other side rooting for you!
    Keep us updated
     
  19. RS8877

    RS8877 Member

    ok ok - i'm back -- I accidentially deleted all my pc Favorites and forget the name of this forum -- so just spend last 20 minutes trying to login to a bunch -- glad I found it.

    OK - so still tapering -- i would say the last 5 days I have done maybe 1/5th of the 8mg/2mg Film -- so it s gtter than my past - which was doing half or 1/3rd ...

    question: Kratom - will that help taking that to help ease off the subs? just recently heard and read up on it -- i think someone might of mentioned this in the past - but i never researched it much then, until just recently read some -- and of course plenty of mixed reviews!

    So - just touching base - and making Progress.. I have about 5 fils left then go back to Dr for another 30 -- ( this last 30 has lasted me 2+ months -- so my goal is to have this next 30 last me 3-4 months to where I eventually don't need it at all.

    I always appreciate and advise or recommendations!! I truly appreciate each and every one of you that has wrote on this forum to me-- You are good people -- and I wanted to thank you -- as you are appreciated -- encouraging me a stranger to become a better person!

    ok - i'll check back in a few days!
     
  20. freakedout

    freakedout Moderator

    Hey rs8877, Glad your still fighting the good fight! Search this forum on Kratom. It may be legal but is cross tolerant with opiates and we have had a few members end up with a whole new addiction to battle because of it.

    IMO, the thought process of using an addicting drug to get off of another addicting drug is fundamentally flawed.
     

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