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Getting off Bupe/Sub, a place to post experiences

Discussion in 'Detoxing From Buprenorphine/Subutex/Suboxone' started by Bup4pain, Feb 18, 2004.

  1. pencils2

    pencils2 New Member

    I don't understand why doctors are so quick to prescribe Suboxone, as if it's a safe drug, and never mention the withdrawal at the other side. I've been on it for about four years (really) and finally decided on my own to taper down. I've done it very, very slowly and was okay until the past few days, when I downshifted from 3mg to 2 mg a day. I feel like I can't move. But I can't sleep either. Nauseous and irritable but absolutely determined to get through this. Then I'll wait another month before going down to 1.5, then 1, and so on. Otherwise, I don't think I"d make it. I can't stand to be so uncomfortable, which is how I came to be an addict in the first place. (As for using Xanax... NO!!!!! Perhaps Klonipin or Valium, but Xanax withdrawal is a living death. No exaggeration. And it takes forever. Just my opinion, of course. From my own experience.)
     
  2. pencils2

    pencils2 New Member

    I think it's taken me about a year to go from 8mg a day to 3mg. When you're working it's hard to be in full-out withdrawal. And I'm a tutor... sitting right next to high school students who are pretty perceptive. So I detox in small amounts, from 8 to 7, then wait a month, then to 6, and so on. I stayed at 4mg a day for three months because it took a while to feel okay. I just shifted down to 3 and I feel horrible. Still, I think that because my doctors were clearly in no rush for me to get off this stuff, I had to make up my own plan. So far, it's hard but not impossible. However, I think it will be much harder once I'm under 1 mg. Guess I'll read more on the topic. Unless it depresses me. I'm just getting out of that, and getting off Sub helps. You don't realize how much it zaps your energy until you cut back. Suddenly I'm feeling okay about feeling nauseous from withdrawal. Imagine that. Don't know if I helped anyone else, but I feel better. Hope someone else will, too. I think we have to inform one another because the medical community is oddly ignorant on the topic. Thanks to whoever started all this....
     
  3. coues1

    coues1 Well-Known Member

    Pencils2,

    I have a similar story of tapering. I was on suboxone 16mg 3 yrs ago. I started after getting off lortab and morphine. I took opiates 2 yrs before detox then took sub 3 yrs. This all started from cancer and a back injury (both Cancer and injury from my career). I knew the risks and still work same career.

    I used marijuana 4 times in my life, don't drink and never have done other street drugs. I have a lot of respect for heroine users who are strong and get clean. I feel I hid behind the "legal heroine" and was not real with myself.

    I tapered from 6mg to .25 mg over 5 months. Started mild wd's last month and had severe insomnia and fatigue when I completely stopped 12 days ago. The wd's have been very inconsistent but manageable. I posted my experience in 7 days no sleep. I was going nuts first 7 days without sleep. I have had 2 days of feeling 90% better and like myself. Your will to stop is how you will succeed. I read these posts to increase my will to succeed and get info.

    12 days of no opiates or suboxone. First 9 sucked last 3 much better but tomorrow may suck. I finally accepted the wd's and took on a fighting attitude against them. I would fight someone physically basically and get my @$$ kicked before I take sub again.

    FYI, the feeling of emotions are real. I did not buy it at first. I thought I felt normal. I have laughed, cried and now kind of pissed (in a good way).

    I also decided to open up this time. First time I had the " I can do this by myself". I have coworkers who I have opened up to and a few who are going to get help. In fact, going to my first meeting Wednesday. I still think I am only physically dependant but am slowly opening my eyes. Many of my coworkers have injuries and psychology trauma so feels good to help.

    Good luck
     
  4. Fairy

    Fairy Member

    Been ghosting around here for a long time. Sorry if this is posted incorrectly posting from a crap phone. A bit of history I've been on some form of opiates since I was in my mid teens. When I was about 23 I was diagnosed with epilepsy, tonic-clonic aka grand mal. After popping everything I could get. I decided to run further into my addiction. My live in "boyfriend" began to rape me when I was out of it after seizures, it got worse & yup he's a scumbag to put it nicely. After I finally got him out I was no longer popping them I was full blow iv morphine, oxy, h, any opiate I could iv. So
    I like every addict withdrew to an extreme isolation which was made worse since with epilepsy I can't drive & live in the country. 5 years go by of doin the same bs everyday, running & numbing. I sure as hell didn't want to face my past.
    On to getting on suboxone & a huge jump off of it. I searched everywhere for any info on subs & someone with epilepsy. Found tons of "subs made me have a seizure" stuff but not someone with epilepsy. I found a sub dr that said he had extensive experience with epilepsy & subs, he lied, ran his patients through like cattle at a feed lot. I was told my insurance would cover everything yet every time they (one dr assistant & the dr. that is almost 90)asked for more cash, finally got the $400 that I had to have up front the first visit. Had to back her into a corner where she knew she couldn't lie to me I do know my rights & medical info so yea. A horrible dr that never mentioned ever tapering anyone off, ever!
    I was put on 16mg of suboxone & was on it for 4 or 5months. Well i was tiered of being on some opiate/opiate-like substance. I mean I remember what I was like b4 all this & I'm determined to get it back! I want to start my life rather than it just being on continuos pause.
    My sub dr appointment was on its way I nor any of my family/friends could afford to pay the jerks. So my "big" taper was now an immediately happening 16mg then maybe 3 days at 8mg then jumped off. ;)
    I thought since when I was using I was always the first one to start going into w/d so I was expecting pure hell plus all the tapering experiences here most recommending slow taper to less than 1mg. I have no idea why but its actually NOT been dying in a ball crying like a baby, running to the bathroom, extreme insomnia, rls, etc.
    It's been over a week with plenty of Imodium, not much sleep (but I have really bad insomnia anyway), cranky, crying but not severe AT ALL that's with the jump from basically 16mg.
    Since as I mentioned I have epilepsy so I want to address this topic. I have at least 2 a week (no they are not under control, taken all kinds of anti-epileptic meds/combos to no avail). I & my family/fiancé/friends really had no reference to how the jump would work or be safe. Asked all kinds of dr.s, neurologist, epilepsy specialist, other sub docs, detox centers the list goes on... no one had any experiences, no clue, the most I got was "I don't know I guess go inpatient hospital detox". Needless to say I defiantly can't afford that! I've had 2 seizures since the jump the difference being since my emotions are a bit wonky(obviously), I've learned to stay calm, watch my temper, etc to not set off a seizure. Both seizures happened directly after my fiancé said some stuff that would normally would roll off my back but my wonky emotions kicked in & I was mad as hell well shortly after bam hit the ground flopping like a fish out of water, lol. The seizures have not been anymore severe or anything & so far there not just random like usual but have a trigger (i.e. losing control of emotions, hormones, extreme heat...)
    I wanted to give some hope for those who are backed into the corner & don't have a chose to taper down & have to make a big jump. Don't make the mistake I did research all you can on your sub doc! There are many good practitioners but there are also many who really know nothing about this drug yet claim they do &/or just want your $. I of course also wanted to also give some info to those with epilepsy & making the jump.
    I hope this helps someone
    ~*Fairy*~
     
  5. StuckonSubs

    StuckonSubs Well-Known Member

    How long have you been off the Suboxone now? Not to be negative or anything like that, but off that large a dose of sub, the withdrawal period does not even really start until day 5 or so. Sub has a very long half life and it will take a week or longer before much of it even leaves your body. People who jump off large doses usually don't start physical withdrawal until the end of the first week. So just be prepared for that in case it happens.

    Also, just so you know, taking,arge doses of Imodium Will stop the physical w/d as well, but it will be waiting there for you as soon as you lower the Imodium dose. Loperamide (Imodium) is actually an opiate that does not cross the blood-brain barrier. There have been many an opiate addict that became poop pill junkies...
    I believe that there is actually an entire thread here on this forum somewhere dedicated to Imodium & the w/d it can cause.

    Anyway, congrats on kicking the sub! That is great. Just be prepared for some crappy days ahead. I know more than a few people who thought they were out of the woods & sub w/d was a piece of cake, only to end up getting slammed a couple days later and ending up right back on the sub.
    Again, I am not trying to be negative at all. I just want you to be prepared is all. Once you get another week under your belt and lower the Imodium dose, then if you're still not feeling much w/d you will know you are out of the woods...

    I hope you continue to post in the coming weeks and keep us updated on your progress. Again, congratulations on kicking the sub! I truly hope that this semi-smooth ride continues for you in the coming days!
     
  6. Fairy

    Fairy Member

    Thanks for the reply StuckOnSubs. I was very aware of the long life of the sub w/d. Btw no negative points taken as anything but trying to help & inform. It's fixing to be 2 weeks tomorrow.
    I am very aware about the laperamide opiate that doesn't pass the blood barrier. I'm only taking it when I have to, like leaving the house, etc.
    As fare how long I just got to 2 weeks. I'm very aware of the PAWS to come too.
    I've been listening to lots of music, reading a ton, drawing, video games, any thing that keeps me occupied & enjoy (I think all the music is driving my fiancé crazy :) lol.
    I do plan on updating plenty. Mainly for others to see another experience here, for people with epilepsy & to let people know how someone else's big jump off is going so far.
    ~*Fairy*~
     
  7. StuckonSubs

    StuckonSubs Well-Known Member

    Oh, ok cool. Then you should be ok. I was thinking that you were less than a week in, and I've heard many people say "oh sub w/d is a piece of cake" on day 3 or 4 only to end up getting slammed on day 5... But if you're at almost 2 weeks you're already past that part.
    Glad that you are also aware of the loperamide.

    Hey, have you ever tried CBD for your seizures? I realize that this may be a touchy subject on this type of message board. But I have seen what a miracle cure CBD can be first hand. I have a close friend who has grand mal seizures very often and has been on every medicine under the sub for them (and those meds had him living on another planet - he'd tell me how he heard the radio talking directly to him (although I suspect some mental disorder though too)) then he tried CBD's (cannabidiol) and hasn't had barely any seizures since.
    I am not sure if you live in a state (or other country) where medical mj is legal at all. If you have access to high CBD medicine I would definitely look into it (it doesn't get you 'high' either. CBD is much different than THC). CBD seems to be the miracle cure for seizures...
     
  8. dumbas

    dumbas Active Member

    I have been on and off drugs since I was a kid. I had 16 years clean in NA, then had an operation. I can handle it. I'm superman. Wrong. Put me on 16mg of sub. No way I said. This was september. Last wednesday I took my last piece. Not feeling great. My dog has zanax for thunder and I had to take a half to go to sleep. Is that OK? Not doing it everynight. Been suffering for almost a year. Suboxine is poison.
     
  9. dumbas

    dumbas Active Member

    I started with 2-8mg strips a day. Immediately went to 1 1/2. The it took time. 1/2 gr a week or so. I had some serious wd at 6 and 4mg. But from 4 down, 1/2 at a time, it seems to be done. I feel like **** but I am not going back to that slavery. I missed so much time in work because of the process. Not easy, great support. Even though it is my dark secret. Not many know. I am so ashamed of what I've done. Very hard on me.
     
  10. coues1

    coues1 Well-Known Member

    Keep up the good work.

    I remember be so upset with myself I wanted to fight and get beat up. Crazy thinking but sleep.deprivation and the emotions you feel are such a rollercoaster. I felt Euphorically happy to pissed. Talking with a friend on this site has helped. My emotions are settling and I am thinking more clearly or sane I guess. You will go through many emotions. I describe it like a grieving process. Learn from the process. Be honest with yourself (lying is a natural human trait but not lying to yourself is different).

    Go through your process and stay focused on the positive parts, learn from the negative and look forward and know you are now a more enlightened person who will not make the same mistakes. You may even change someone else's future for the better having gone through this.

    Who knows? I know people here have made me better.

    I hope you are well and you should be proud
     
  11. Fairy

    Fairy Member

    StuckOnSubs,
    Oh I was so worried/dreading days 4-7. Reading & knowing people who have gone through it I was waiting for hell to open up & eat me! I was beyond surprised & kept waiting for the other shoe to drop & then swifly kick me in the rear. No it wasn't/isn't a walk in the park or the pasture, or mountains or any place your shoes to walk.

    I know from past experance that PAWS are going to be a big issue for me. Hell since I started opiates since 13/14 years old (I'm 30 now). I know my brain & body have a lot of fixing what I chose to do it. It's amazing what we'll do to ourselves that we could never have fathamed b4 our addictions.

    I'm in Oklahoma wich is a backward state(the last state to legalize tattoos only a few years back, backwards like said) I wouldn't be surprised if it the last for this to. Closest is Colorado, I really want to try charlettes web or the like. I've heard some amazing things but can't get any here, have to make a road trip. Almost the last option besides a vegas nerve implant in my brain, EEEK! I have an issue with them messing with my brain more then the AEDs side effect. Your friend isn't alone I've had AEDs that made the mad hatter seem calm & collected, but I do also have bipoler 2. So maybe the effects were more wonky, shrug. Sorry I know this is off topic.
    ~*Fairy*~
     
  12. edubl

    edubl Member

    Ive been off sub for 5 days now. Started at 12 mg four years ago, the last 2 years have been at 3mg and the last six months have been at 1.25mg. I feel ok physically but I have absolutely ZERO ambition. For those 4 years on sub I felt good. 2mg was a good dose for me and honestly I was enjoying life like never before, I didn't need to use any more than 2 mg.

    My psych and counselor convinced me to try Vivitrol. I'm taking 12.5 mg of naltrexone currently and at some point in time will receive a injection of naltrexone that will last a month.
    At 5 days after last sub the big question I'm having is "why am I doing this?"
     
  13. Cidmonster7

    Cidmonster7 New Member

    I have been on Sub for about 5 years now. I was going to wait until May/June(that is when I would run out) to stop taking it but for some reason I just woke up the other day and said I have had enough of being dependent of this stuff. That was three days ago. I had tapered down to 1/16 of a strip for at least a year. Anyways, so it has been 72 hours since my last dose and I didn't sleep for crap last night, my body wanted to stretch the entire night. I finally took something about midnight to help knock me out and it did for a few hours. I have diarrhea today and it doesn't seem to be letting up. I have avoided this DT for awhile now making excuses that I have too much on my plate like being a single mother, just purchasing a new house, working a very demanding job, etc. etc. but If I keep on using those excuses I will never stop taking it. It will never be a 'good' or 'convenient' time to stop. So anyways, glad I found this forum. Good luck to everyone.
     
  14. Bonita

    Bonita Well-Known Member

    Welcome... CONGRATES!!!!!

    I suggest you pick up some Immodium AD and can take double doses for a while to help with the wd syndrome. Magnesium/calicum at night for RLS, clonidine if you can get MD to write script. Good luck.... only why to end it is stop ingesting the dope and just get thru it. Come here and keep up us to date how your doing. Lots of experience here to help you.

     
  15. Cidmonster7

    Cidmonster7 New Member

    Thanks Bonita! Today is day 5 and I finally got some sleep last night. Even though I don't feel like death I don't feel great either but it sure isn't anything I can't handle. Dope DTs are WAY worse than this. I can still function at home and work and that would have never happened if coming off of herion or K4s.

    Anyways, it's almost like I have cold like symptoms; a lot of sneezing, a bit of a runny nose, a bit of a body ache, and my stomach is still a little upset especially after eating but at least I have an appetite! I just keep telling myself that this won't last forever and that I can do this!

    I find that if I keep moving and stay positive it helps a lot!

    Okay well keep your head up guys! <3
     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2014
  16. Fox face

    Fox face Moderator

    Congratulations! The positive attitude helps tremendously! You are absolutely right, these symptoms won't last for ever.
    keep up the good work:)
     
  17. Cidmonster7

    Cidmonster7 New Member

    Day 11

    I feel pretty normal. I mean I don't have the motivation that I had before but that is to be expected since I am not using a foreign substance to give me that motivation. I believe in time my energy level will normalize and I will be use to the way I am.

    With only going through about 8 days of withdraws that weren't even that unbearable I would suggest to people wanting to taper off to move to the strip so that you can actually fold it in half enough times to get to a low dose like .5 mg. That isn't to say others will experience the same thing I did because everyone's mind set and body chemistry is different but I do believe that one of the reasons I didn't go through horrible withdraws was because I was barley putting anything into my system for such a long time, at least a year.

    Good luck to everyone and know that you can kick this. :smile:
     
  18. roosker

    roosker New Member

    How is everyone? I'm glad to be reading so many success stories on here since I'm in the process of creating my own at this very moment. Just to put it out there, I started off with roxys 4 years ago, my senior year of college being the beginning of this ****ed up journey in life. Got stuck on up to 120 mgs of roxy a day at the peek of my addiction. Going broke and refusing to shoot up was what brought me to the next phase of my journey... Subs... My issue was that I was not getting my subs from a doc, instead I had a friend of a friend who was in the same boat as me trying to get off a roxy habit. My "sub guy" would hook me up once a week with 7 days worth of sub, 8 mgs (1 strip) a day. Pretty soon I became comfortable with the idea that subs were saving me from having to deal with WD and even the thought of coming off them scared the living **** out of me...

    Well let's fast forward 2 years, give or take, to the day my "sub dude" told me he has discontinued his script and that he was going into rehab to detox off of them... Ooook.... So now I'm sitting there with my you know what in one hand, and 1/4 of an 8mg sub strip In the other hand. Luckily i had been tapering down of sub up to that point and was right around 4 mg of sub a day the day that my "friend" broke the news about his script... So of course as anyone who has been on sub for a long periodic time, you make that last piece of sub last as long as you possibly can! Duh!?!

    Ok ok so anyway, the day came where I had the choice to either make the jump or call my old roxy dealer and hope to God he wasn't arrrested or dead... Well I decided to make the jump and I was more scared about making it than anything else I can ever remember. I made the jump off of 2 years of suboxone "abuse/maintenance" 22 days ago from today. The first 10 days were probably the most crippling 10 days of my life. The discomfort both physical and mental, including but not limited to: no sleep, freezing cold, zero motivation to move let alone do anything else, diarrhea, latharga, depression, anxiety, and many more ****ed up things that I'm sure you all know about. The worst part about this whole experience was the fact that nobody knew what I was dealing with. My 4 total years of addiction and detox were all kept inside my mind and I was too ashamed to let anyone know what I was faced with. On day 8 of my detox, I decided to reach out to a good friend of mine who was once an addict and had now been in recovery for 3 years and ironically works professionally as an addiction counselor. This was the best decision that I made in my whole detox process because I was able to dump this built up cluster **** of **** out of my own mind and get advice from a friend and professional in the field of addiction recovery.

    As I mentioned earlier, today is my 22nd day clean. I am back in the gym and doing my best build my body up to what it once was before the start of my recovery process. I have found a lot of benefit from my workouts in my recovery process, and I highly suggest getting yourself into some kind of physical fitness regimen as soon as you are able to in your recovery process. I was unable to get back in the gym until day 12 of my recovery, but everyone's different, and when your ready your ready, but I highly suggest getting yourself moving as soon as you can to get regain some level of physical and mental control over your own body.

    i will be posting more in the near future, and I just wanted to share a brief glimpse of my process to give all of you another perspective on the recovery process. The way I look at it, everyone who decides to get clean has to take a slightly different road in their process to regaining control of their life. I didn't go to rehab, I don't go to AA meetings, and I can honestly say that my whole process is looked at with much skepticism in the recovery community. All I know for certain is the fact that I'm here, 22 days clean from opiates, and my motivation to stay clean has never been higher. Each day is a journy in my battle, and there are NO regrets, only goals. I respect each and every person on this forum for having the guts to take back control of their own minds and bodies, and I hope the feeling is mutual. Love you all, be strong, never quit.

    -RC
     
  19. Fox face

    Fox face Moderator

    Hi and welcome to ODR. I'm doing great! Congrats on getting your life back. There's no better feeling than to wake up not needing drugs to function. Keep moving forward and keeping busy helps. Sounds like your well on your way:)
    take care and keep posting.
     
  20. DownByLaw

    DownByLaw New Member

    Hi, I have been taking 1-4 mgs of suboxone daily for about 8 months, and finally decided to quit.

    My last dose was 5 days ago. My WD symptoms haven't been too bad, compared to other experiences I've read. For me it's mostly restlessness, headache, depression, craving, nightmares.

    But the past two days when I'm able to sleep, when I wake up I feel absolutely terrible, like I'm about to die. Once i force myself to get out of bed and move around the feeling slowly goes away.

    I've read similar experiences with people who are still on sub's, and the feeling subsides after their morning dose takes effect, but my symptoms subside once I get moving around and woken up, without consuming any substance. I'm not too worried about it,
    I know sub detox can be a slow, painful process, but just want to know if anyone else has had this experience.

    P.S. Anyone who suffers from chronic depression and anxiety, look into ketamine therapy, it's completely legal and very effective. There are a number of clinics across the US. I believe "Psychedelic" drugs can be amazingly healing when used properly. It seems like the medical establishment is slowly figuring it out. Good luck to everyone.
     

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