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  1. #1
    VFR800 is offline Junior Member
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    Default Over-The-Counter substitute for Clonidine?

    Hello,

    My girlfriend and I each had H habbits of about 1 balloon / day. I realized that we were reinforcing eachother's addiction, so I left town for a month. I tapered down with H, during the first week, spent the second week shaking, and now, in week 4, I almost have my energy back.

    She, unfortunately didn't fare so well. She has tapered off a bit, (down to 1/4 balloon / day), but completely quitting is difficult for her. Reading the forums, It seems like Clonidine is good for the accute withdrawl symptoms, but neither of us want to admit the truth to a doctor, to get a script, because we want to keep this off of our medical records.

    Is there an Over-The-Counter drug that works like Clonidine?

    Thanks to you all for reading this, and especially thank you for this board. Reading it has saved me during the last month!

    Mike

    P.S. Does anyone know how much actual diacetylmorphine is in a balloon. Obviously, it varies by region and dealer, but, ballpark. I've spent the last month educating myself about the related physiology, and I am wondering what percentage of my naturally produced endorphins did I displace with the H.

  2. #2
    Agent Subby is offline Senior Member
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    Jun 2006
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    Manchester, England.
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    Default

    quote:Originally posted by VFR800

    Hello,

    My girlfriend and I each had H habbits of about 1 balloon / day. I realized that we were reinforcing eachother's addiction, so I left town for a month. I tapered down with H, during the first week, spent the second week shaking, and now, in week 4, I almost have my energy back.

    She, unfortunately didn't fare so well. She has tapered off a bit, (down to 1/4 balloon / day), but completely quitting is difficult for her. Reading the forums, It seems like Clonidine is good for the accute withdrawl symptoms, but neither of us want to admit the truth to a doctor, to get a script, because we want to keep this off of our medical records.

    Is there an Over-The-Counter drug that works like Clonidine?

    Thanks to you all for reading this, and especially thank you for this board. Reading it has saved me during the last month!

    Mike

    P.S. Does anyone know how much actual diacetylmorphine is in a balloon. Obviously, it varies by region and dealer, but, ballpark. I've spent the last month educating myself about the related physiology, and I am wondering what percentage of my naturally produced endorphins did I displace with the H.
    Don't mean to be funny but WTF is a balloon? In England they are inflateable rubber things that kids play with. Dya mean a weighed bag of H?

  3. #3
    VFR800 is offline Junior Member
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    Default

    Short answer, Yes. A balloon is a bag. It is a little square of a supermarket plastic bag wrapping about 100mg of black tar. Then the whole thing tied in one of the inflatable rubber things that kids play with. They measure about .75cm in diameter.

    Long answer:

    Apologies if anyone takes offense, here. What I am saying is To-The-Best-Of-My-Knowledge, I was never directly involved with these people (dealers), this is just what I've heard. I am only trying to be factual. I am half Mexican myself.

    Here in the American Southwest, the Mexican cartels have a monopoly on gear, as you limeys call it ;) They will try to kill anyone who tries to import it via other channels. In other places, drug distribution occurs in a multi-level-marketing fashion, through a bunch of independently operating distributors. Big dealers buy kilos from importers, who sell ounces to smaller dealers, who sell dime bags to users, or something like that. Buy more, get a better price.

    The Mexican cartels are cutting out the middle man. They are operating more like a traditional big-business. By bringing the End-User-Distribution In-House, they can get $70,000 per kilo of H, versus like $15,000, which used to be the going rate. I'm talking about black tar, not China-White, which basically doesn't exist in the Southwest. So, here, it doesn't matter how much you buy, you pay the same amount. 1 balloon, $7 ($10 if you are white) 10 balloons, $70. 1000 balloons, $7000.

    Balloons have another advantage. The runners cary them in their mouths. If they are stopped by the police, they can swallow them without risking overdose. Then, since they would have no drugs on their person when they are searched, they are free to go.

    In addition, the cartel only employs people who have family back in Mexico, so that the low-level employees are too terrified to inform up the chain.

    What I don't know is how pure the black tar is. Is it 5% diacetylmorphine, or 80%? I guess I could chemically isolate it, and convert it to a hydrochloride salt (China-White) to find out, but I don't have any, and I never want to touch the stuff again!

    Mike

  4. #4
    arlenewla is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
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    Los Angeles, CA, .
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    Default

    quote:Originally posted by VFR800
    Reading the forums, It seems like Clonidine is good for the accute withdrawl symptoms, but neither of us want to admit the truth to a doctor, to get a script, because we want to keep this off of our medical records.

    Is there an Over-The-Counter drug that works like Clonidine?

    Thanks to you all for reading this, and especially thank you for this board. Reading it has saved me during the last month!

    Mike

    P.S. Does anyone know how much actual diacetylmorphine is in a balloon. Obviously, it varies by region and dealer, but, ballpark. I've spent the last month educating myself about the related physiology, and I am wondering what percentage of my naturally produced endorphins did I displace with the H.
    Hi Mike ~

    And welcome to the board!

    Frankly, I don't know if there's anything OTC that's quite as efficacious as Clonodine.

    I used it for Methadone WD and found it to be a life saver.

    Regarding keeping it off of your medical chart; is this because you're submitting it through insurance? I certainly understand if it's insurance/job related.

    If not...if you're paying cash for the visit...don't worry about it. Alternatively, how about picking a doctor that's not your treating family physician if that's part of the problem?

    I am a believer in NOT keeping secrets from any doctor when you're trying to break the cycle of active addiction. Letting them treat you in a "vacuum" without a full understanding of what you're trying accomplish may be counter-productive.

    Should you secure Clonodine, be aware that you should monitor your BP so as to not become hypotensive. Also, move slowly. Don't pickup your head suddenly. Clonodine may also induce some fatigue/lethgary. And lastly, don't stop it cold. Taper it at the end, otherwise your BP can go UPPP.

    Let us hear from you! G-D's speed. Warmly, Arlene

    Oh..PS: I don't have a clue as to what percentage of natural endorphins were displaced by H*. It is what it is, as they say. What I do know is that [u]replacement </u> of these endorphins/serotonin takes TIME. Exercise and the body's natural healing process will work wonders...eventually.

    Arlene F.
    EXODUS FROM MMT
    NOW HAPPY, JOYOUS & FREE

  5. #5
    Agent Subby is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Manchester, England.
    Posts
    257

    Default

    quote:Originally posted by VFR800

    Short answer, Yes. A balloon is a bag. It is a little square of a supermarket plastic bag wrapping about 100mg of black tar. Then the whole thing tied in one of the inflatable rubber things that kids play with. They measure about .75cm in diameter.

    Long answer:

    Apologies if anyone takes offense, here. What I am saying is To-The-Best-Of-My-Knowledge, I was never directly involved with these people (dealers), this is just what I've heard. I am only trying to be factual. I am half Mexican myself.

    Here in the American Southwest, the Mexican cartels have a monopoly on gear, as you limeys call it ;) They will try to kill anyone who tries to import it via other channels. In other places, drug distribution occurs in a multi-level-marketing fashion, through a bunch of independently operating distributors. Big dealers buy kilos from importers, who sell ounces to smaller dealers, who sell dime bags to users, or something like that. Buy more, get a better price.

    The Mexican cartels are cutting out the middle man. They are operating more like a traditional big-business. By bringing the End-User-Distribution In-House, they can get $70,000 per kilo of H, versus like $15,000, which used to be the going rate. I'm talking about black tar, not China-White, which basically doesn't exist in the Southwest. So, here, it doesn't matter how much you buy, you pay the same amount. 1 balloon, $7 ($10 if you are white) 10 balloons, $70. 1000 balloons, $7000.

    Balloons have another advantage. The runners cary them in their mouths. If they are stopped by the police, they can swallow them without risking overdose. Then, since they would have no drugs on their person when they are searched, they are free to go.

    In addition, the cartel only employs people who have family back in Mexico, so that the low-level employees are too terrified to inform up the chain.

    What I don't know is how pure the black tar is. Is it 5% diacetylmorphine, or 80%? I guess I could chemically isolate it, and convert it to a hydrochloride salt (China-White) to find out, but I don't have any, and I never want to touch the stuff again!

    Mike
    Hey cheers for the that Mike. Pretty interesting info. I'm posting at this unearthly hour because I've just relapsed on my subby 'programme' by smoking gear;) for a week. Just had my second dose of 2mgs of bupe to try and stay of the gear again. I've gotta do it this time. God how many times have I said that? 90% of the gear in the UK is Afghani brown (based I presume for smoking) and there's been some really strong stuff around ATM hence why I'm not sleeping. My last wrap (gear tightly wrapped in cling film)was on Friday night so the subby dose should be kickin' in tomorrow. All the best in your quest.:)

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