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  1. #1
    gliadin is offline Junior Member
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    Default Subutex for Fast Detox - Good or Bad Idea?

    Hi everyone,

    I thought I'd share my experiences of coming off Subutex having used it to fast detox off of heroin. I'm currently on day eleven having been on Subutex for a week. I've been completely clean for four days now.

    The purpose of this post really is to let people know what they're in for. I strongly advise people who are considering taking Subutex for the first time to read this, as if you were like me and didn't know a lot about it, then you're in for a shock. I'm still no expert and I would advise reading these forums, they have helped me HUGELY over the last eleven days. It's why I'm posting really, to say thanks to everyone for being so honest on here - there have been some very very dark days over the past eleven days and the people here have gotten me through it, just by being able to read their experiences.

    Anyway, I was smoking H for about 3 months, ended on using about 2 grams a day, so a fairly high amount as it was high grade stuff. I decided to come off using Subutex as a way of pushing it through more quickly and had hoped to mitigate or completely remove the H WD's. Friends had told me they'd had a very easy time coming off of H by using Subutex for short periods of time. I've come off H a couple of times before but the quality of it had been very low, the period of usage short and the reasons for taking it completely recreational, so the WD's were three days of hell and then absolutely fine. This time I was using pure H so I expected a more rough time, hence the Subutex.

    I bought Subutex off the street. I decided to use Subutex without any medical supervision or advice. If you're going to be taking Subutex for more than three days, I strongly advise you not to do it without talking to a doctor first, and even then, read these forums too as most doctors really aren't that clued in, unless they've treated a lot of people before. My advise, ask your doctor how many people they've treated successfully with Subutex before you take their medical opinion as gospel. The course they take to be allowed to treat people is NOT comprehensive - Google Subutex and you'll find PDFs of the advice given to doctors. Quite frankly, the side affects and the withdrawal symptoms from Subutex are HUGELY underplayed in the medical profession and very few doctors actually lay the truth down on the line for you, as their primary concern is getting you off the 'illegal' opiates.
    That's not a reason not to take it at all, but it is a reason to investigate what you're getting in to.

    Another piece of advice I'd like to give to people who don't know a lot about Subutex and are considering taking it short term to come off something like H is this: DO NOT take it while you still have opiates in your system. I smoked two grams of H at 3 am, slept for 7 hours and then took 8 mgs of Subutex as my first dose. It threw me straight into full blown CT's: vomiting, explosive craps, that iceberg like coldness CT's gives right to the core of your body and the rest of it. If you want to get the CT's over and done with quickly, you can do it this way, but I don't advise it. Wait at least 24hrs before taking Subutex if you've been using hardcore opiates. The feeling sh*t for 24hrs is better than what I experienced. It was like the first day of CT's without any pharmaceuticals all rolled into four hours. Is it worth it to get it out of the way? In my experience, yes... maybe... I'd expect people mainlining H doing this would actually be quite dangerous though as it throws your body into shock. For me, I preferred four to five hours of horror than a full two days of it. But believe me, it was a truly horrific four hours.

    It took three full days of CT's, each day slightly easier, using 4mgs in the morning and four at night, before I started feeling better. My first dose on the first day was 8mgs straight up, then the next two days I used 8mgs of Subutex split into two doses (morning and night). The CT's were still there, but not as bad as I had experienced before so the Subutex does what it says on the tin. It does reduce WD sy

  2. #2
    Nomadic's Avatar
    Nomadic is offline Senior Member
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    Wow, really a great post. Should be a "sticky" maybe. I do want to warn you about the depression that you will endure. You probably already know that but your brain needs to heal from the abuse.

    Sure the Sub can help with the initial WDs but the short term and long term not so much. Time is the great healer.

    A very well written post and very honest. Thanks for articulating what many of us feel with our own personal experiences.

    Take Care,

    nomadic (Paul)
    [8D]

    "an honest man's pillow is his peace of mind" John Mellencamp Minutes to Memories

  3. #3
    Freefly's Avatar
    Freefly is offline Senior Member
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    Just another good reason why not to buy subs or methadone from the streets to kick. Use a doctor or a detox if you can not kic cold. Now what are you going to do to stay clean and sober?

    Day by Day is the only way....

  4. #4
    lilac girl's Avatar
    lilac girl is offline Senior Member
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    Hi,
    thankyou for sharing your story.
    I was condidering your EXACT plan, also to come off smoking h. (im assuming your in thr UK like me?)
    The reason being i come across subutex being sold more frequenly, many peeps have scripts for it now.
    But i waited and bought methadone instead. Reading your story has made me very wary though, cos although the two drugs are very different, they both share the long half life, and being hit with w/ds 30 hours after my last dose of meth,
    i mean i wonder if thats a possibility??
    Im certainly glad i didnt use it for detox now, i had a script of it ages ago, but didnt get on with it at all.
    Was just considering it for very short term use like you did, just goes to show how strong this stuff is.

    Do you have any plans in place recovery wise?

    Lilac girl
    Hugs NOT drugs

  5. #5
    KB
    KB is offline Senior Member
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    wow--this story shows you WHY you must be in withdrawl BEFORE taking sub! PW'S are no joke.

    robin

  6. #6
    gliadin is offline Junior Member
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    Nomadic:

    Thanks for your response. I have come off H before without any cravings/issues with relapses. I suspect this is because of the reasons why I use H every now and then. For me, it isn't a crutch, it's a lifestyle choice for the short term. First time I came off I was clean for five years, second time eight months and now who knows, I've no desire to do more now. I won't go into more details than that, as I don't think it'd be helpful to others. I only mention it because I suspect I'll be fine with the depression, as I have been on previous occasions, once my brain readjusts and gets used to producing the right chemical balances again. This has been my experiences in the past. I don't suffer from depression naturally and only ever get it when coming off H or in this case, Subutex. I suspect anyone who takes anti-depressants would need serious medical supervision while coming off Subutex as I can't honestly see someone who is clinically depressed being able to come off Subutex and stay sane.

    Anyway, to answer your question Freefly, my plans in the long term are simple really: ride out the physical CT's, wait for my mind to readjust, and then continue with my life. I'm luckier than most, I suspect, as I can take or leave H psychologically and have never craved it after coming off it.

    Lilac:

    I wish you all the best with coming off H. I think, in hindsight, I would come off H without any other drugs, be it methadone or subutex, if I were to go back and do it all again. But I guess it all depends on why you started taking H in the first place and how much you use and for how long. For me, it was always a physical addiction for no longer than three months, so it's just a matter of readjusting. In that situation, I would do it cold, as horrifying a prospect as that is. I've had friends who were smoking for years and came off cold in a week, physically. Right now, I'm in day 12 and I still am not feeling 100%. This is the longest CT's I've ever experienced and I'm fairly certain Subutex is the reason. I've had friends who have come off H under similar circumstances with methadone - but they're the same friends who said Subutex was easy, so I really don't trust their opinion.

    My advise? Take the dive, if you're not psychologically in need of H because your life is sh*t. I much prefer 3 days of horrifying CT's than what is now almost two weeks or PAWS. If you need to get high because you're escaping then I strongly advise you not to come off alone, without support. Psychological escape will latch on to anything, be it subutex, H or methadone, it really doesn't matter which one you're on, you'll struggle to come off any of them under these circumstances. In terms of pure physical addiction though, I'd advise against methadone or subutex if you feel you can cope. They just complicate things.

    All the best, and let us know how you get on?

    Gliadin

  7. #7
    bodnik is offline Junior Member
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    ive just had a 4 month relapse....after being able to stay off gear for a whole TWO WEEKS......im doing this exact plan as we speak .....im taking as little as poss jus to feel comfortable (today 1st day n had 3 ml)....hopin for two tomoz....i'll let everyone know how the detox n quick subbie thing works......i have sum colodine, n a few valium to help as well(thank god)

    adam

  8. #8
    bodnik is offline Junior Member
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    oh ive bin on up to a teenth a day jus so's ya know's

    adam

  9. #9
    Bonita's Avatar
    Bonita is offline Senior Member
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    God.... makes me shiver reading your post. I also was thrown into PW's. My *** of an Addiction Md had me take Meth the day before, gave me script and told me to take 40mg when I got home. I cant tell you how bad it was. This was on a Friday and he went out of town for the weekend. It was the worse experience I ever encountered. I was on it for about 6 months.

    With help from this forum I wean off and suffer anther 6 months of wd, depression and lack of will to live.

    I would not advise anyone to take sub even for three days... but hey, that is just me.

    Great post, hope all read it that are sitting on the fence of taken sub or not.

    Bonita

    <center>omission is not honesty, only different ways of lying</center>

  10. #10
    jdude's Avatar
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    My guess is things may have changed for glaidin in the last 6 months?

    <center>You can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking that caused them in the first place.</center>

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